Atheism, Religion and related discussion


#211

I think you really can’t compare the white supremacists from nowadays to the nazis from 1930-1940.
Back then, before Hitler showed up, people had to work their asses off in the morning. With the money earned, they had to stand in hour long queues in front of food stores. And why was everybody in such a hurry to buy food? Because their money earned that very same day wasn’t worth shit in the evening. This was the economical condition of Germany around 1930.

Now I wouldn’t call myself a nazi, but if I lived under these circumstances, I would probably be interested to see someone who says: “You will get your very own car. The Volkswagen!” and “I will make Germany strong again!”

The overall nazi from nowadays might be way worse than the overall nazi back then. Of course, back then you also had people who joined the SS. Those were some sick fanatics, but the economical condition is much better right now, so this means the nazis from nowadays particularly worship Hitler’s ideas when it comes to Jews.


#212

Since when did my like usage concern you? That was both out of context and unnecessary. To quote the forum guidelines:

I’m sorry if this seems aggressive but I’m a bit annoyed. Condescending comments about the expenditure of other user’s likes should not be deemed acceptable.


#213

The immediate economic situation of Germany and it’s economic situation for the foreseeable future was indeed, bleaker than anyone should be expected to tolerate. However, it’s worth remember that America is a nation where people are told they can bootstrap their way from nothing to millionaire, but also one where many people must work two full time jobs just to make ends meet and where entire towns and regional areas are being economically destroyed due to shifts in international business (manufacturing contracts, oil pipelines, genetic modified crops, etc) To say nothing of their healthcare system being financial roulette.

The gulf between the havs and the haves not is massive, and many of the haves who control the industries common people work in (Walmart for instance) are deeply invested in reducing the rights of the haves not - while essentially blaming this on outside elements (such as latino immigrants, refugee seekers, etc)

America is not as bleak as pre-WWII Germany, but it also has a much bigger myth as to what constitutes “being great again” due to generations of people buying into propaganda that proposes everyone can live like the top ten percent. It’s also focusing on Middle East as it’s big enemy rather than the League of Nations (which is really unfair to the Middle East).

These are largely the sorts of promises that people supporting white nationalism indirectly are buying into:

“You will get a job once we throw out the immigrants/women.”, “You will sleep safe at night once we oust the refugees/criminals/deviants.” and from there it’s easy to lead them to one more step toward a doing something terrible. “We can’t get rid of the foreign workers until we get rid of the unfair dismissal laws.” “We can’t get rid of the foreign workers until we get rid of the foreigners who will protest.” “We can’t get rid of the foreigners until we deny them the right to due process…” etc.


#215

Ignoring random things that you cannot prevent like child-onset cancer, healthcare in America truly is a ticking time bomb when it comes to the average person, especially due to how the obesity epidemic is timed (it has yet to truly ravage our system, that will come in ~20-30 years, and it will only get worse unless there is a massive culture shift).


#216

According to you. Forgive me, but I think the people who did the study and people from the peer reviewed journal know better.

No, I did not.


#217

lol, appealing to authority but only when convenient. Standard


#218

What are you on, this time? I’m curious :slight_smile:


#219

What am I on? High on life, fella


#220

#221

I’d say these days more so.
Well centuries ago there was killings and battles by Christians, but these days we have better morals. Either way you’re right, Commandments do pave a way for a better living in ways especially over other religions :slight_smile:

Even as a Christian country, we still know right from wrong and amend our laws, not by The Bible but fair morals too.

That’s why we do not need religious laws like Sharia crap that promote death and inequality.

Actions speak louder than words right. Which religion is doing damage the most recently?


#222

You have a point, but i will not put all blame on Islam for what extremists is doing in the name of Allah, because saying all Muslims or Christians is bad, because some groups abuse the God’s name is not right.


#223

Oh no, I’m not saying to put everyone in the same boat but if a large group of people are getting this belief from a specific source. That source must be the reason behind it? If they feel that doing damage to others is their culture or what they have been taught, should they be the target focus?

Like drugs, you go to arrest the dealer (the source) over the druggies to stop the chain.

Majority of Muslims know right from wrong and only follow the peaceful part, like most Christians don’t go around hating on gays. They know fair morals. The fact there are so many types of Muslims and paths and interpretations seems a little fishy right? Shouldn’t there be one true belief of Islam?

Never use God’s name in vain, I agree :slight_smile:


#224

I see the discussion on this forum is going on about the Islam and its terrorists, and people saying not everybody is a terrorist.

Of course not every Islamic person is a terrorist, but I saw a video (can’t remember the name) where was said the good part of the people was irrelevant.

For example: Germany, 1939
There were around 79 million people living there. When the nazi regime came on, the amount of nazis were ESTIMATED to be around 10% of the whole German population. So that’s about 8 million people. However, these eight million people succeeded in getting a good 50 million people killed.

The Islam has about 1,5 billion people, and it is estimated that around 12% of those 1,5 billion has radical ideas about the Islam, thus forming a potential thread. 12% out of 1,5 billion are quite a big group of people.

So what I’m getting on; In the Islam, there are good people, just like in Germany 1939, but the good part doesn’t really matter, as the evil part can inflict very much damage, especially with many people.
Maybe I’m missing a point, but this sounds sensible to me.


#225

While you are not completly wrong, I want to point out that fighting Nazigermany included to attack the civilians. (carpetbombings on Dresden, Cologne, Belrin and so on) One might argue that this was needed to stop them, yet I find it wrong since not everyone was surely supporting the system.

So if there is a war against Islam about to start, I find it as wrong to target peacful muslims just because this way it is easier to fight the extremists. I know the US generals have a different opinion on it, dropping bombs and droning groups of people because maybe most of them are the “bad” people.

So what I want to say is that your point can be considered to be right, but just be damn careful what you conclude out of it.


#226

#227

50 mill?

https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10008193

Calculating the numbers of individuals who were killed as the result of Nazi policies is a difficult task. There is no single wartime document created by Nazi officials that spells out how many people were killed in the Holocaust or World War II.

To accurately estimate the extent of human losses, scholars, Jewish organizations, and governmental agencies since the 1940s have relied on a variety of different records, such as census reports, captured German and Axis archives, and postwar investigations, to compile these statistics. As more documents come to light or as scholars arrive at a more precise understanding of the Holocaust, estimates of human losses may change.

The single most important thing to keep in mind when attempting to document numbers of victims of the Holocaust is that no one master list of those who perished exists anywhere in the world.

What follow are the current best estimates of civilians and disarmed soldiers killed by the Nazi regime and its collaborators.

Jews: up to 6 million

Soviet civilians: around 7 million (including 1.3 Soviet Jewish civilians, who are included in the 6 million figure for Jews)

Soviet prisoners of war: around 3 million (including about 50,000 Jewish soldiers)

Non-Jewish Polish civilians: around 1.8 million (including between 50,000 and 100,000 members of the Polish elites)

Serb civilians (on the territory of Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina): 312,000

People with disabilities living in institutions: up to 250,000

Roma (Gypsies): 196,000–220,000

Jehovah’s Witnesses: Around 1,900

Repeat criminal offenders and so-called asocials: at least 70,000

German political opponents and resistance activists in Axis-occupied territory: undetermined

Homosexuals: hundreds, possibly thousands (possibly also counted in part under the 70,000 repeat criminal offenders and so-called asocials noted above)

Jewish Loss by Location of Death

With regard to the number of Jews who died in the Holocaust, best estimates for the breakdown of Jewish loss according to location of death follow:

Auschwitz complex (including Birkenau, Monowitz, and subcamps): approximately 1 million

Treblinka 2: approximately 925,000

Belzec: 434,508

Sobibor: at least 167,000

Chelmno: 156,000–172,000

Shooting operations at various locations in central and southern German-occupied Poland (the so-called Government General): at least 200,000

Shooting operations in German-annexed western Poland (District Wartheland): at least 20,000

Deaths in other facilities that the Germans designated as concentration camps: at least 150,000

Shooting operations and gas wagons at hundreds of locations in the German-occupied Soviet Union: at least 1.3 million

Shooting operations in the Soviet Union (German, Austrian, Czech Jews deported to the Soviet Union): approximately 55,000

Shooting operations and gas wagons in Serbia: at least 15,088

Shot or tortured to death in Croatia under the Ustaša regime: 23,000–25,000

Deaths in ghettos: at least 800,000

Other*: at least 500,000

Sum:

I find it hard to believe it was 8 mill nazi criminals :flushed:.

http://motlc.wiesenthal.com/site/pp.asp?c=gvKVLcMVIuG&b=394663#35

  1. How many Nazi criminals were there? How many were brought to justice?
    Answer: We do not know the exact number of Nazi criminals since the available documentation is incomplete. The Nazis themselves destroyed many incriminating documents and there are still many criminals who are unidentified and/or unindicted.
    Those who committed war crimes include those individuals who initiated, planned and directed the killing operations, as well as those with whose knowledge, agreement, and passive participation the murder of European Jewry was carried out.

Those who actually implemented the “Final Solution” include the leaders of Nazi Germany, the heads of the Nazi Party, and the Reich Security Main Office. Also included are hundreds of thousands of members of the Gestapo, the SS, the Einsatzgruppen, the police and the armed forces, as well as those bureaucrats who were involved in the persecution and destruction of European Jewry. In addition, there were thousands of individuals throughout occupied Europe who cooperated with the Nazis in killing Jews and other innocent civilians.

We do not have complete statistics on the number of criminals brought to justice, but the number is certainly far less than the total of those who were involved in the “Final Solution.” The leaders of the Third Reich, who were caught by the Allies, were tried by the International Military Tribunal in Nuremberg from November 20, 1945 to October 1, 1946. Afterwards, the Allied occupation authorities continued to try Nazis, with the most significant trials held in the American zone (the Subsequent Nuremberg Proceedings). In total, 5,025 Nazi criminals were convicted between 1945-1949 in the American, British and French zones, in addition to an unspecified number of people who were tried in the Soviet zone. In addition, the United Nations War Crimes Commission prepared lists of war criminals who were later tried by the judicial authorities of Allied countries and those countries under Nazi rule during the war. The latter countries have conducted a large number of trials regarding crimes committed in their lands. The Polish tribunals, for example, tried approximately 40,000 persons, and large numbers of criminals were tried in other countries. In all, about 80,000 Germans have been convicted for committing crimes against humanity, while the number of local collaborators is in the tens of thousands. Special mention should be made of Simon Wiesenthal, whose activities led to the capture of over one thousand Nazi criminals.

Courts in Germany began, in some cases, to function as early as 1945. By 1969, almost 80,000 Germans had been investigated and over 6,000 had been convicted. In 1958, the Federal Republic of Germany (FRG; West Germany) established a special agency in Ludwigsburg to aid in the investigation of crimes committed by Germans outside Germany, an agency which, since its establishment, has been involved in hundreds of major investigations. One of the major problems regarding the trial of war criminals in the FRG (as well as in Austria) has been the fact that the sentences have been disproportionately lenient for the crimes committed. Some trials were also conducted in the former German Democratic Republic (GDR; East Germany), yet no statistics exist as to the number of those convicted or the extent of their sentences.


#228

I’d like to add a lot of the radical Muslims like ISIS, were brought up to believe that they are right. They are brought up the believe that women are slaves and crap. They think they are doing nothing wrong in accordance to certain phrases in Quaran they’ve interpreted. Obviously they are because we know what freedom, rights and democracy is so to us, so they are terrorists. They know no different but still doesn’t excuse their actions in their own country. Scum. That MOAB solved a few problems.

There’s people like Maajid Nawaz and Brigitte Gabriel who have been on both sides of the spectrum, experienced the consequences of Islamic religion and can tell you which is nothing but bad. Why current preaching of Islam is globally damaging. Both people I highly respect due to their backstories.


#229

Yes, that’s the one!


#230

Brigitte Gabriel, the most influential leader in America’s increasingly influential anti-Islam lobby, is a master of tonal contrasts. It’s part of what makes her a gifted public speaker: She’ll charm you before she terrifies you.

And Gabriel is, if nothing else, in the business of terrifying people. When she took the stage in Twin Falls, Idaho, in early August, it sounded like the opening track to a live rock album: “Hello, Idaho! I love you too!” she yelled, while the crowd of nearly a thousand whooped and cheered. Then things got dark, fast.

Not surprised about she saying good Muslims is irrelevant, she is anti-Islam and i don’t think good Christians or good Muslims is irrelevant.


#231

I find it very questionable to trust people just because they are sympathic. And then they claim to know “facts” because they were served by their favourite person on Youtube. LOL

EDIT: A statement should not lose weight if you dont name where you got it. This is hard, I know, but keep in mind that trusting people to know what they say has not the same quality than knowing it yourself.