In-Flu-Ential Duck exclusivity problem

[Hotel_Pollisya]

Hello everyone, I wanted to address a small, but important issue that I haven’t seen anyone else pointing out.

So, this is about the In-Flu-Ential Duck in particular, but can also apply to some other items to a lesser degree.

The item is pretty unique in its properties – it’s an emetic that attracts attention and is proximity based. It’s not game-breaking or overpowered or anything, but the point is – it is unique and can be used in unique ways no other item can. And it’s locked behind awkward, arbitrary time limit and IO Account shenanigans.

Not only this item is locked behind external factors, there’s a good chance some people would never get a chance to use it simply because they were “late” to the game. With reskins it’s mildly annoying but harmless, with something game-changing like this – it’s just an objectively bad decision, why gatekeep a mechanically unique item behind some arbitrary exclusive conditions?

As a relevant example, there are some community competitions that are considering banning time-limited items and this duck in particular since otherwise it would be unfair to the players that didn’t get the chance to obtain it. Some big fuss over some small niche items, but unfortunately that’s the way it is.

There are some other items where this applies as well. The Trophy duck linked to Creator program that’s being discussed right now in other threads, some items from Bruce Lee and Eminem time-limited DLCs (some of them are actually unique albeit in very minor ways), and personally I’d urge against putting mechanically unique items even in non-time-limited DLCs (such as Multipass from Milla Jovovich DLC).

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So what’s the immediate solution? There are some very simple options.

1. Make sure these time-limited items would be accessible later – just like this was done with some Twitch Drops. Ideally though a permanent ability to unlock them would be preferable.
2. Create “reskins” of such time-limited items – mechanically identical but different in appearance items – and make them accessible via other non time-limited means, such as ordinary challenges etc.
3. In the future – watch out for more of these cases. Whenever there is a time limit or anything alike, make sure there is no mechanically unique content like unique unlocks behind it. Reskins are fine.

There, problem solved.

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Obviously, this topic is part of the global problem that plagues WoA and manifests itself in many ways:

FOMO and the Future

Hey Everyone, This topic is meant to give clear and concise feedback for IOI Staff and raise concerns one might have for items and unlocks in IOI Singleplayer Titles. I’m putting this Topic in the Off-Topic category simply because while at the time of typing this out IOI’s only live service title out at the moment is HITMAN WOA, but the intention is to rope in 007 First Light and its Sequels, their Fantasy Project, and the future of HITMAN. So let’s begin. FOMO, or “Fear. Of. Missing. Out” in …

[Dribbleondo]

@Hotel_Pollisya

The item is pretty unique in its properties – it’s an emetic that attracts attention and is proximity based. It’s not game-breaking or overpowered or anything, but the point is – it is unique and can be used in unique ways no other item can. And it’s locked behind awkward, arbitrary time limit and IO Account shenanigans.

Except…not really.

If the Durian wasn’t as powerful as it currently is, then I’d agree. But there’s never a reason to not use it, even for speedrunning. So long as you have access to the target, it doesn’t make much of a difference if it’s proximity based or requires throwing. It might even be faster to throw it, depending on the level. I’m not saying it can’t have a niche, and the concern is warranted in general when it comes to items being locked behind temporary conditions. But this item is just not useful to most players, the Durian is simply more powerful because it’s instant and legal to throw – two very attractive properties to an item.

This whole situation is the result of the Power creep of emetic weaponry I’ve been banging on about for the past year and a bit. This item is a direct casualty of this problem. It’d be a great weapon otherwise, and your concerns would be much more valid. But The current situation means the bar for nuanced emetic item picks is very low, so anything inherently skillfull to use is superseded by the Durian for most players.

To repeat, this is still a concern for unique items in general, but it’s hard to say this applies here, at least right now.

@Hotel_Pollisya

(such as Multipass from Milla Jovovich DLC).

Ah, that’s an interesting case. This is a legal to use keycard scrambler, which is balanced by only having two charges. I dare say that doesn’t make it balanced considering very few levels require even two charges to enter restricted areas. So the DLC essentially gives the player a better version of an already-existing item.

[Swangtheugly]

@Dribbleondo

This is a legal to use keycard scrambler,

Any HITMAN fan that has knowledge of the maps knows we need know keycard scrambler to get to where we need to go

[Hotel_Pollisya]

@Dribbleondo

Except…not really.

Ok, now this is exactly why I mentioned this is not about the duck being overpowered or anything A player can definitely play the game without it and not miss out on much. It wasn’t about the duck changing the game in a drastic way, rather about it giving more options.

The duck of course is not a durian replacement for the straightforward “approach target – drop or throw the emetic – wait at the toilet” approach, but it can attract NPCs visually or audibly and make them sick on its own without 47’s direct involvement – something a durian obviously cannot do. With a durian you’d have to try very hard to emetic a person across the map (which is funnily enough actually possible albeit convoluted), while the duck does give you that opportunity.

Admittedly, you can only take advantage of that opportunity in some niche cases, but isn’t this what Hitman is about? Finding creative uses for everything, including mechanically unique unlockables? Otherwise we can just call it a day and give up on 95% of unlocks justifying it with “well you can just durian the target and kill them so why bother with anything else”.

I get the durian is a balance issue but it’s a separate problem. If anything, the duck is an incentive for players to try something different other than durian. Unless of course they don’t have it which brings us back to the OP.

@Dribbleondo

So the DLC essentially gives the player a better version of an already-existing item.

I can’t vouch for what I’ve found out from other people (I don’t have the DLC), but apparently it’s even better than that. You know how in some places it is illegal to swap the keycard unless you’re in a certain disguise? Which is btw a stupid mechanic imho. Well, apparently Multipass is legal to use even there. So it’s more legal than actual appropriate keycards!

@Swangtheugly

Any HITMAN can’t that has knowledge of the maps knows we need know keycard scrambler to get to where we need to go

Well, with this mindset there’s no need for bringing most of the items on levels at all, as you can always find their counterparts or figure out some gameplay alternatives. Unlocks mostly just make your life easier or allow you to do something faster

[Dribbleondo]

@Hotel_Pollisya

Ok, now this is exactly why I mentioned this is not about the duck being overpowered or anything A player can definitely play the game without it and not miss out on much. It wasn’t about the duck changing the game in a drastic way, rather about it giving more options.

But that was never my point. I gave background to keep any potential readers informed, but my main point was that the options this duck brings up is completely nullified by the current game balance where the Durian is the best emetic item in the game for most cases. On its own, the duck would be quite good and nuanced. But that isn’t the landscape we’re playing in.

@Hotel_Pollisya

but it can attract NPCs visually or audibly and make them sick on its own without 47’s direct involvement – something a durian obviously cannot do. … With a durian you’d have to try very hard to emetic a person across the map

Okay, but that simply isn’t what emetics are used for by most players. The instantaneous nature and legality of the durian is what makes it so attractive, and it’s often worth any detour to use it because of it. You still need to set the duck up in the place you’re expecting a target to go (and hope nobody else goes near it!), and you probably want to be near your target, because of how hard it is to judge a routine half-way across the map, even with Instinct (and especially if you’re in the middle of doing something else). I’m not saying it’s not do-able, but it’s a lot of faffing about for the same outcome.

@Swangtheugly

Any HITMAN can’t that has knowledge of the maps knows we need know keycard scrambler to get to where we need to go

The mindset of “there are always alternative ways” ignores the powerful items that makes said ways less attractive. The game has deliberate placement of illegal-to-use doors to work as a puzzle to unlock them/ bypass them (requiring a keycard or distraction/ flashbang). If you can access a publically visible illegal door by having an unlockable item, then it completely breaks from that puzzle design. The doors in Berlin’s nightclub is a good example.

@Hotel_Pollisya

Unlocks mostly just make your life easier or allow you to do something faster

But IOI’s idea of making your life easier is apparently “making it better than what came before”, which when you make an item outright better than what you find elsewhere, while not having appropriate downsides, it leads to power creep, which is now where we’re at. This is the precise opposite of good game design. We’re living through the consequences of IO not nerfing things properly, and making items that make others redundant, through sloppy balancing ideals (or worse apathetic balancing ideals).

On another thread, someone gave the example of melee’s being more powerful between 2016 and 2 (actually 2016 → late 2016). The Claw Hammer was the first item that was not a breakable melee which was made unlockable. On the surface, that looks like a similar situation to here, but in actuality, they both have a niche (hammer is slower but reusable, breakables are faster but one-time, and can also be used for particle boosting), but both are interchangeable in their use-cases, so in actual gameplay, it’s not much of a difference, if at all. You still need to be close to the target of your concussion antics, and the speed only matters if you’re going for a faster time. And the breakable item can be replaced with another item, because levels always have plentiful melee items within them that you’re expected to pick up as a player (the gaming adage of “steal everything in a room unless it’s nailed down, and when it is, grab a claw hammer, because it soon won’t be”), so it’s not like that’s a big deal either.

The reason the newer breakable items are not liked is partly because of their context. Neither the shaker or the pinot noir bottle make puddles when they’re dropped (despite visibly dropping water/ wine), and the former is made of metal, which is decidedly not easy to break, so any potential gameplay opportunities to set it apart from the others are lost.

That, and they feel like in-level props turned into unlockables. Like something you’d get out of a randomiser mod. At least the shaker is loosely James Bond-related.

@Hotel_Pollisya

I get the durian is a balance issue but it’s a separate problem. If anything, the duck is an incentive for players to try something different other than durian. Unless of course they don’t have it which brings us back to the OP.

It is directly linked to the issue, I can’t see how it isn’t. It’s the same kind of item, it just activates differently, which makes it comparable to, and exemplifies, why the durian is an issue, and why it makes the current state of emetics problematic. And as you said, the fact it’s limited time just makes the duck situation so much worse, as it means anyone who plays after this event won’t have it, so all potential is lost unless they make an alternative to it.

They’ll re-run the ET eventually (I can’t see them not doing that), but it goes back to the very topic of this thread, where the duck exclusivity means the item, however small its niche is, will not be used as much simply because a lot of people won’t have it! You can’t share any tips or tricks on how to use it, if the item is so hard to get! As much as I think the duck is mostly superfluous, I also don’t think it should be limited time either. It is a gameplay object, not a suit.

Apoligies for the very…very long post. I had a lot to say.