Is the Molotov Cocktail too unbalanced?

And if you choose yes, you can comment about what IO should do with it?

  • Yes
  • No

0 voters

3 Likes

First, IOI should completely get rid of the ‘accident kill’ it provides, since death by molotov has never been an accident, unless perhaps the thrower got the wrong person or dropped it on themselves.
Then they can work on the bugs with it, namely the wallbangs and the fire being triggered through a dart gun.

2 Likes

Molotov = fire. Fire = accident.

Who said that’s a bug?

12 Likes

There is a few different ways to use it that it does seem somewhat unbalanced in that it can be used to get free accident kills - but honestly at the end of the day its a single player game. It’s really up to the player if they want to use them or not.

So overall I’d say no since there is still that element of choice.

11 Likes

I’d say balance is important in a singleplayer game - a balance of skill, fun and time. However I don’t think the molotov is unbalanced except for a couple of bugs because it takes skill to use and is fun to be good at using

1 Like

I reckon they should lower the range as that will make it less OP for wall bangs, i saw your Colorado video Frote! :wink: And it will also be harder to aim due to the radius drop OR just make it illegal in ALL disguises as it’s not normal to be a bank guard and carry a molly.

It’s useful for a normal run, but it kills the divisity of speedrun when everyone is using molotov mortar. It’s upseting to know that everything I did is simply defeated by the mortar. If IO think the electric phone is unbalanced and removed it, then molotov is way more unbalanced than it. I hope that everytime I watched a speedrunning video my reaction would be like “Jesus how the hell did they do this!” intead of “another molotov mortar, boring”.
(I know some speedrunners who only want to finish the level as fast as possible and don’t care if the run itself is boring and uncreative. Don’t bother to refute me I already know what you want to say.)
Molotov is fun and I don’t want it to disappear like the phone, so here is my suggestion:
for IOI if they may concerned: make molotove impossible to set fire crossing walls and floors. You can now simply burn the target by throwing a molotov on the other floor without having any risks, that’s unfair. Molotov is powerful, so it should be risky to use. Making it unable to attack crossing walls and forcing players to go near the target would be a good balancing adjustment.
for the speedrun community if they concern: molotov is a great break-through for speedrunners but it also makes it boring. A speed contest becomes a competiton of “Let’s see who’s the best at using the molotov mortar!” So my opinion is that we set up another category of “no molotov” where those who love the classic way could still have something to work on. For me the fun of speedrun is “let’s see who’s the fastest, no matter what method you use!”, and that makes it colourful and diverse. But now with molotov mortar faster than anything else that diversity is disappearing. That’s not what I want to see.

Wait IO added the Electric Phone but with fire?

12 Likes

Like @thrison said, It’s a single player game. It doesn’t affect anybody other than a number on a leaderboard. It was stupid to remove the electric phone and will be stupid to remove more content.

Is it a crutch? Yeah, but one still has to do effort to unlock it in the first place.

Its out released, and probably already used in runs for top leaderboards. Taking it away now means the actual competitive aspect has become unfair until something better comes out.

If you think it’s too powerful - don’t use it. Simple.

10 Likes

I’m looking forward to flamethrower ‘accidents’ in future games, including ‘accidental’ dismemberment with grenades.

7 Likes

I mean, if someone doesn’t want to use a technique or item in their game because they think it’s cheap and easy, they’re just free to choose a more challenging approach for themselves?

I know what I’m about to say next can be misunderstood as me saying “devs cater too much to speedrunners”, but I really don’t mean it that way:

I would rather not see an item or kill opportunity removed from my single player game that I play non-competitively just because a (valid, of course!) fraction of the playerbase says it’s ruining their competitions or hard-earned achievements.
Not meaning to play this down in any way, I understand where you’re coming from, but it would be a more sensible approach to just ban certain techniques or items in competitions than to demand that they’re removed for the entire playerbase.

4 Likes

Unless someone witnessed 47 throw it, nobody would know it was even a Molotov until an in-universe investigation was performed, so in the moment, it’s seen as an accident, exactly as how poisoning someone doesn’t cause an issue until, in-universe, and autopsy is performed, because everyone else just thinks they dropped of a heart attack or an aneurysm.

4 Likes

I think we’re past stuff being OP in this game, for example on Ambrose there’s a water bucket right where Noel Crest walks past, so isn’t the Micro Taser OP? The Emetic device can give you a free kill, it’s all up to the player and what they want to do, it’s not as if anybody can’t use these items for speedrunning

7 Likes

Eh honestly I don’t think the Molotov is that game breaking in terms of speedruns. Most levels are extremely optimized at this point in a way where you barely need to even be close to the targets. I think Molotov will constitute like 10% of speedruns at bespt.

1 Like

I’d have assumed that something so overpowered would be a bug! If the molotov fire is meant to penetrate walls, so be it.
Its the second glitch that matters, the double use

1 Like

That’s not a viable excuse in any game. As the e-phone proved back in 2018-9, and as every multiplayer game continues to prove, people can, and will, take what’s the best and/or the fastest to kill a target/ beat a level. If anything, this looks much cooler too, even i’m curious to try this out, further giving people incentive to use it.

Balance matters in any game, single player, multiplayer, driving, simulation, any and all genre’s. If it didn’t matter, then A; the e-phone controversy never would’ve happened among players, and B: games would be far less fun to play. Gunplay and balance matters in any game.

If you’re wondering why this comes off as particularly bitchy, it’s because I keep hearing this in defense of the E-phone, and i’m sick and tired of hearing it.

2 Likes

And yet, that argument did and still does hold up. So what if people use the fastest option? It’s their game to choose their option if they want to do it fast. Affects multiplayer? Don’t allow it in multiplayer. Affects speedrun scores? Stop keeping scores. Everybody who loves using the Molotov (or any supposed OP item)? Keep enjoying it!

10 Likes

No, it really doesn’t. This is people blatantly ignoring the argument to continue using the item. If they have fun using it, that’s fine by me, that is divorced from the conversation here. It’s still a bad argument that doesn’t hold up when players try to claim it’s not op “when you don’t have to use it” when lots of people did use it, and encouraged its use.

For the record, I haven’t touched the molotov yet, i’ll leave that to when I actually get round to using it. From what i’ve seen so far, I have no issues with it being an accident kill, it’s very much akin to a poison kill imo.

You can’t exactly throw it into a group of people otherwise you risk killing others, there’s some nuance to it, instead of just being a literal free accident phone that only one person can ever pick up and get killed by.

1 Like

Well, I think the molotov is pretty crazy, but in a fun way and not in an unbalanced way.

The electrical phone was quite lame and nothing more than an auto kill switch, but the molotov has much more interesting mechanics and uses other than getting one cheap kill here and there. As well as a few more limitations to which kinds of cheap kills you can get with it.

6 Likes

Yes, it is, because a single player game is about what provides the most fun for me and me alone. It doesn’t affect anyone else but me. And if I decide that the most fun I can have with a game is by taking the easiest route, that’s my decision to make and mine alone. It doesn’t affect your gameplay at all.

If I decide that I want to go for Silent Assassin in every run (which I do), I’m not affected by people who decide to throw a duck at their target in every single run. If I decide to take it slow and roleplay in each playthrough (which I do), I’m not affected by people who shoot at three specific corners of a wall, then drop a muffin and three coins and a breaching charge before exiting the mission. :upside_down_face:

This is like complaining about people who use the motherlode cheat in the Sims to build the mansion they want to build, while they themselves work their way up from the crappiest toilet and a microwave.

Different playstyles are valid, and what people do in their own game doesn’t affect anyone but themselves.

6 Likes