I can understand this point, to a degree. There are some speedrunners that stream on Twitch that seem to think they are gods gift to the community and are throwing statements around like “IO are performing a direct assault on the community” that are just way over the top and are also wondering aloud why IO are punishing the players (ie themselves) “that do so much for the game by streaming it all the time and are the reason the game is successful”. Bitch please.
Some of these particular speedrunners have let their egos get a little too big and are just throwing tantrums by threatening to “quit to destroy the game” and are the ones that make me think “I hope IO does it” just to spite them.
Couldn’t say even if I want to - they’re the ones that are just all copying each other and doing the same thing over and over that they just blend together in my mind.
I’m the conspiracy nut? You’re the one making fake info up about “performance reasons” despite zero indication from any IOI dev that is the case lmao.
“IOI has the right to remove it” is the most meaningless argument ever. They also have the right to patch the game to be literally unplayable, to crash half the time, to change every mission in the game, remove Silent Assassin rank from the game, remove story targets and replace them with different ones, to shut down the servers and make large portions of the game not acessible. They have “the right” to do all that. Doesn’t mean it’s okay to do all of that. Literally meaningless argument.
It’s not a meaningless argument, but “performance reasons” is almost certainly fallacious.
The core purpose of the particles is to provide a visual effect for authenticity. Instead, they also provide an out-of-bounds exploit.
Patching out the exploit comes at the cost of upsetting speedrunners who are psychologically attached to the exploit because they have achieved records from using it.
To claim it will somehow kill speedrunning is absolute nonsense, it will merely kill speedrunning that leverages OOB exploits. Comparing the patch to deliberate destruction of intentional core game mechanics like Silent Assassin is ludicrous.
that just goes back to my argument of what constitutes a good speedgame. Yeah people will still speedrun it the same way some people speedrun Telltale games. The particles are one of the core ways Hitman speedruns continue to evolve. Remove it and then 80% of the game already has the best possible times they will ever have because particle-less routes have already been perfected for years and years. There’s not very fun on watching or playing a speedgame where you can only get miliseconds of improvement.
Hilariously, people like “thrison” who don’t understand speedrunning in the slightest and complains about “doing the same thing over and over”, removing the particles will effectively doom Hitman speedrunning to be that for the rest of time, much, much more than before.
You say that but the same thing can be achieved with in-world objects such as vases that were not patched.
WR run of The Warlord uses one such vase in 47’s Room. The “ideal” solution that IOI should enact is keep the particles (the performance impact is negligible) but make them not collide with 47. You keep the realism of the environment, but you remove any glitches that could stem from it.
I’m sure it was because they were overlooked. They may patch it. I’m still in favour of making them all not collide with 47.
I should also preface my original message:
Chandeliers already do this exact thing.
Certain parts of certain chandeliers do this. The ones in the dining area in Bangkok are half this and half parts that collide. Majority of chandeliers don’t have exceptions like this.
Exploiting is using an inherent game feature, glitch or bug for unintended purposes, that usually result in an advantage. Anyone with the knowledge of an exploit can use it, and the devs can try to fix it.
Cheating is using software made by a third party to get an unfair advantage in a game. The advantage can only be gained by using said cheat software, and the devs can only indirectly combat it by implementing measures that detect and hinder outside tampering.
It’s a single player game, why are people so pressed about a sizeable part of the community having fun in their own way? I don’t speedrun and prefer to play the game “normally”, but I can appreciate the skill and ingenuity that they employ, as well as the amount of time they’ve spent grinding the game. Mind you, they wouldn’t being speedrunning the game if they didn’t fundamentally enjoy it like the rest of us.
I encourage all of the speedrunning haters to watch a GDC event, or a Summoning Salt video, it’s just as valid as hardcore roleplaying and not shooting npc’s since they leave bloodstains, disregarding that the ai intentionally are incapable of noticing it, which is imo more egregious than the muffin skip, which doesn’t affect 99% of the playerbase.
I don’t have a dog in this fight as I don’t play in a way that particles make any difference, but in my perspective, the only real impact that the speed running community has on the non-speedy player base is in the leader boards and the more vocal members who, historically, were among those were involved in discussions about things like electrocution phones and Molotov accidents (and I’m not really even sure those were speed running complaints, to be honest).
As a normal, non-speed focused player, I have come to terms with the fact that I will never be in the top ten (or likely even top 100-1000) on the leader boards for pretty much any contract I play. The time bonus that speed running gives make it all but impossible for a slow player to break into those ranks. Beyond that, it doesn’t impact me one way or another if some glitch allows a player to hop over a wall.
While I do miss things like the electrocution phone, the ship has sailed on that and I’m over it.
I just don’t see the point in slinging mud or putting down a group of players. IOI is free to fix whatever bugs they want, but they would be wise to consider all sides of the player base before they do so.
This is exactly what I’m talking about, if you have nothing to add but insults, please keep it to yourself. I’m not even a speedrunner, if they removed this tommorow it would have zero effect on me. But I do love watching speedruns, and I feel for players who are against their games becoming less fun for them.
This is a healthy way of looking at it, even if I’m firmly in one camp.
I’m gonna die laughing if Freelancer comes and literally nothing changes. As much as I wish IO would just clear everything up, if this is the plan, I’m down
Exactly. It’s not like a long list of changes that aren’t present in v3.130 (aka the current retail build of the game) were found in the CTT to suggest we were getting a glimpse of what the next patch will do.
For all we know, simply IO broke something when they shoved Freelancer into the current build and have absolutely no intention of removing the particles.
Its very likely the particles are removed in Freelancer because they believe it jepordazies the difficulty of the mdoe. Whereas they approve its use in non-randomized settings like main missions
