Is the Molotov Cocktail too unbalanced?

no, it is basically the electric phone of H3 and I miss the electric phone :anguished:

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I dunno, those things @BradleyPaine mentioned do sound like legitimate bugs, and are arguments that I think have merit.

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molotov cocktail has actual risk to its use, something the electric phone had none of. and it’s 10x cooler, so it’s fine in my books

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That’s just funny. If you can nail a trick shot and hit Silvio Caruso from across the map, I feel you earn that.

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To say the least:

Elusive Targets (or any time-limited content to a lesser degree)

Hundreds of players testify that they were too scared to do anything creative in order to not fail, as any other method kill apart from the phone involved risks of some sort. (And don’t start with the “EPhone is not a free kill, because you still have to go to your target, give them the phone and then go to the exit” here - apparently this titanic effort is required with all kill methods in the game). What is the point of “just not using the phone if I don’t like it” if you can fail and get punished for it by missing on the suits rewards, while everyone else goes with the stupid phone and gets rewarded?

Contracts Mode.

In case there is a “Killed by Electrocution” requirement, why should you bother finding or creating a water puddle, placing a proximity taser so it wouldn’t be noticed by guards and luring a target here if you can just give them the phone? Same goes if there is no Kill Method requirement. This is especially relevant if there is a time limit involved - why would you try anything that would cost you more time and risks than using the phone? It was such a big issue contract creators literally had to work around the phone by limiting player’s approaches or adding an additional difficult target to waste the phone on, so it won’t be used on any other actual target. But the whole community game mode suffering from a single item in the game is no match for fun gotten from a phone going bzzzt.

Overall gameplay and tactics being dumbed down.

You know how some newcomers get misguided or misunderstood that Hitman is a 3rd person shooter or a stealth action? They quickly get schooled by the game that makes these approaches relatively hard and instead teaches them to social stealth.

Next step is giving up spontaneous kills that get a low rating for elaborately planned and creatively set up kills that get rewarded with the Silent Assassin rank.

Then players unlock the EPhone that requires no preparation, no effort to use, no risks involved and that gives them the highest ranking possible - plainly skips the essential gameplay feats of Hitman - and start using it everywhere, thinking this is the endgame, the final and the best item to rule all the missions. Eventually they would realize that the phone robs them of the essence of the game, but alas.

This is well illustrated by the fact that any guide for any piece of content involved the phone. The only question was which of the targets would fall by the phone’s metaphorical hand, while others would actually be killed in a creative way.

Yes, competitive

Yes, there are some aspects to the game that can be considered competitive. Some of them, not everything in this game is about competition, duh. But while you’re at the “everyone needs to get their fun” attitude (everyone except speedrunners :thinking:?), disregarding these aspects because you personally don’t care about them is simply weird, slightly hypocritical even.

So let’s see. The leaderboards! Duh! They’re not here only for speedrunners. It is only natural (for some - not everyone) to get a quicker result and move your nickname higher on the board, especially if it’s Friends Leaderboard. This is one of the reasons the game is mostly operating on online basis, for God’s sake. But what good are your efforts if whatever method you used would still likely be outclassed by EPhone runs?

Once again, Elusive targets. Why use anything more risky than the phone if you may miss out on the rewards when everyone and their mother will have them?

Once again, Contracts Mode. Why actually put some effort to complete a certain number of contracts needed for a reward (the likes of Hobby knife) if you can just cheese most of the job with the phone?

Some food for thought: competition is usually meant to breed creativity.

But it’s a single player game. It’s your choice to play a contract. If it’s too hard for you to complete - don’t touch it, right?

It is game-breaking for the reasons stated above.

Some glitches might not be game-breaking in a sense that they make it impossible to play, but they still need to be fixed, right? But why should they, if one can choose to not abuse them and another can have some fun with it? Because this is not intended way to play the game that damages the devised game-design. Phone went against basics of Hitman gameplay and therefore was removed.

Great, you don’t deny being slightly hypocritical here? What you’re saying here is false anyway. You’re saying as if every single speedrunner somehow lobbied the phone removal for their own benefit. The phone wasn’t simply a quicker way to run the game, what it did was removing the challenge of everything Hitman gameplay shines at.

While it’s irrelevant to the subject, I must also remind that Hitman runners are not average game speedrunners that simply abuse all the glitches in the quickest way possible, they are doing pretty much the same thing as all Hitman players by figuring out different strategies, just at the angle of how different approaches might benefit their speed. This is why their input on gameplay mechanics is appreciated by casual players too as their knowledge of gameplay is important to anyone.

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P.S. I spent quite a lot of time writing that so I think I should write this to not waste even more time, mine or anyone else’s.

@Heisenberg I’m truly sorry if I came off as condescending or rude, I respect your opinion and think you’re a cool dude. Let’s keep this discussion meaningful and if you don’t agree with my arguments let’s simply agree to disagree and move on.

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Not at all, I didn’t take it as being rude or insulting, don’t worry. I don’t hold grudges. Disagree though I may, you at least kept your arguments rational and presented properly. No worries, we’re cool. While I’m at it, since they’re likely to respond tonight, same to @Dribbleondo and @47saso47. I know I argue with you guys on this subject endlessly, but it’s never been personal.

The only part I’ll respond to was your example toward ETs; that people are too scared to try anything new for fear of failing an ET. That’s happening anyway, even without the use of such items. People use poisoned food, the Sieker and toilet drowning, shooting a placed propane flask, etc… These behaviors are in response to ending the ET as quickly and easily as possible with a successful outcome, so this is happening whether you have the phone or molotov or not, so I don’t think that’s a valid reason.

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I think there’s enough drawbacks to the molotov cocktail that make it reasonably balanced. I understand how it can possible ruin puzzle contracts with fire kills but I just replayed the Uncool featured contract carried over from H2 and I honestly had more fun doing it with the molotov than the intended way. You can molotov Rico through the villa gate right at the start of the level, it’s hilarious.

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Think smarter not harder.

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I know I know. And I don’t take it that way. We’re talking about a video game and how we passionately feel about it. :grin:

I don’t think it went against ioi’s intended design. I think they got influenced by seeing how op it really was. Maybe they didn’t think of it cuz back in the alpha, they had poison bubble gum. Basically the exact same thing but a reskin.

And just like sedative items, they designed it to have bodies found count against SA. So what happened? They got influenced by a big player base saying it shouldn’t and they eventually changed it.

Such as?

Hitman (20) characters

You are clearly clueless about the competitions hosted by the community, but that is okay.

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Hosted in the game? If not, then it’s not part of the game, and anything an “OP” item does to affect it is not my concern. I can understand the leaderboard stuff, much as I hate it, but that’s at least part of the game.

Your concern isnt our concern frankly.

Never said it had to be. Long as we understand each other.

Yes, understood that youre completely clueless about the compeittive area of the game <3

I’m clueless about many things, I’m sure. A lot of them are probably irrelevant.

Like your playstyle smh

Illegal to carry in non guard outfit, illegal to throw in any outfit, can easily be thrown to close to target to get explosive device kill which is non accident and thus non SA if anyone sees, can easily get other non targets nearby caught in flames. It going through walls is pretty powerful but it’s not an instant guaranteed SA item.

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